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American Reformation
We believe the American church needs reformation. To go forward we must go back. This podcast will explore the theology and practices of the early church and other eras of discipleship multiplication and apply those learnings to our post-Christian/secular American culture. American Reformation is a podcast of the Unite Leadership Collective. Follow us at uniteleadership.org. We consult, bring together cohorts of congregations for peer to peer learning, and certify leaders for work in the church and world.
American Reformation
Infiltrating Society with Love and Truth with Rachel Grack
In this conversation, Tim Ahlman interviews Rachel Grack, a writer and editor, about the power of the written word and the role of storytelling. They discuss the need for reformation in the American Christian Church and the importance of infiltrating society with love and truth. They also explore the impact of social media on communication and the value of taking time to think before responding. Rachel shares her love for writing and her experience as a children's nonfiction author. They discuss the hero's journey and how suffering and sacrifice can shape and change the human heart and mind. They also emphasize the hope found in the narrative of the Bible and the faithfulness of God. Finally, they address the decline in writing skills and offer encouragement to younger leaders to improve their writing through reading and practice. In this conversation, Rachel Grack and Tim Ahlman discuss the importance of finding your writing style, writing from the heart, and allowing the Holy Spirit to lead. They emphasize the value of reading and how it can help us better understand others and grow in empathy and compassion. They also discuss the discipline and persistence required to finish writing a book and the importance of quieting distractions to hear from God. They highlight the concept of the window of tolerance and the need for Christians to live in peace, joy, and creativity. Rachel shares her love for Jesus and how her relationship with Him has grown over the years.
Welcome to the American Reformation Podcast, tim All communicator. As a preacher, proclaimer of the word, I actually find as much joy, if not more joy, in the written word as I do in the spoken word seeing the impact of that. So I have one of the editors for the Unite Leadership Collective's blogs that come out. I got a book that I'm working on and she's helped toward that end. She's the author and editor of you're going to hear this story I don't think I'm exaggerating dozens and dozens, maybe even over hundreds of books. We're going to hear from Rachel Grack today. Rachel Grack is in the house. How are you doing, rachel?
Speaker 2:I'm doing great. Thank you for inviting me house how you doing, rachel.
Speaker 1:I'm doing great. Thank you for inviting me. Hey, this is going to be fun. So kind of standard opening question as you look at the wider American Christian church. I know you've been connected to Christ Greenfield for a number of years. How are you praying for reformation, if we think about that word reformation in the American Christian church, rachel?
Speaker 2:I see a need in our culture our society right now, just really to storm the culture to get Jesus back to the center. I feel there's so many things pulling people in other directions. To get the focus back on Jesus, just to get the church out there, infiltrate, so to speak, society and just kind of revive a love for Jesus and get our focus back where it belongs and get our focus back where it belongs.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like that. Infiltrate and revive, you think, some of those words. You're using offensive words, right, but the infiltration is love, because God is love. Jesus is the Word made flesh, and so the posture in which we move into the world it's not, you know, it's not in a condemning way, though we will speak truth about where there is error, to be sure, in the assault against a family, etc. But we go out with love and truth. Let's just talk about Jesus here. Jesus had this amazing capacity to lift up the broken, capacity to lift up the broken right, the hurting, the marginalized, the lost, and for those who were maybe abusing power, those that were leading through lies, he would speak truth to them as well. Hard, hard words. Anything about the way that Jesus kind of led, with a soft touch toward the broken and a harder touch, the law, coming into the powerful, if you will, the prideful. Anything there, rachel.
Speaker 2:Yes, the word that comes to mind is humility. Jesus just had a way of being soft and gentle. I think that one thing I know. I struggle with it too, and I see this a lot when you're when you're reading I don't know if you get sucked into reading comments on social media, but there's a lot of self-righteousness and I always say, oh, that doesn't help, that does not help because it immediately turns people away. And I struggle with myself trying, okay, how do you say this? Sometimes I don't say anything at all because I'm afraid I'm going to say something that's going to come off as haughty, and just to kind of try reminding myself to stay humble, stay humble. That's not helping when we come at it with a posture of just I'm better than you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, there's something to the written word. It can kind of pierce and cut and there's tone through the written word and I've found, when I use words, the written word rather than this is the value of podcasts, by the way, and conversation in real time. It's hard to hear tones. Well, you can hear tone actually through it, but if I were to respond to someone and get into a debate with a written word, those sometimes may be helpful. I think conversation is much more helpful, so you can hear nuance, you can hear a little bit more tone and you can get a little bit more context through relationship face to face, right? Anything more to say about maybe debating in the social media space? Rachel?
Speaker 2:Oh boy, less is more, probably. Yeah, I, you know, when you talk about the written word, I usually now, with social media, it's a little different, because people are so reflect, they just act on impulse rather than thinking things through. You think about that, that rule that they say, when you're going to make a big purchase, always wait 24 hours before you do that, so that you, you know, you think about it. And we got to hold our tongues a little bit, or our fingers, whatever, whatever our tool is for communicating, hold that in. Do I really want to say this? Do I? Do I really want to say it like this?
Speaker 2:And the one thing that's nice about written word and not necessarily in social media posts is that if you have more time to be intentional about the words you choose and you can read it over several times and say how does that sound? How am I coming across? That's why I always I'm not one really for what I would call flash brilliance or you know, just sudden, oh, I have a really great idea. It just comes to me just like that. I'm more of a ponderer. I think things over and oftentimes I'll say something and then the next day I'll think, boy, I don't even agree with what I said, and so you know, I like that about writing is you have time to kind of to reread it, and I like no, it doesn't sound right, I have to redo that or whatever. So, um, yeah, it's, it's, it's an opportunity to hold your, your tongue, or just slow down yeah, yeah, god made me a certain way and I'm passionate driven.
Speaker 1:But the last thing I want to come across as both in written, spoken word, is a hothead. I think of the word reasonableness. Let your reasonableness be made known to all people. The Lord is at hand. And so how do I start to slow down? Think about what I'm saying, how I'm going to say it.
Speaker 1:We've actually written some of our blogs that you've helped me with. Some of them are a little bit more to the point, I would say Frank, and sometimes in the written word I think we water, we kind of walk around topics rather than just. Here's the issue. It's not personal toward one person. We need to just solve these problems and we need to kind of what leadership is. Is you kind of clearly name that problem?
Speaker 1:But the last thing I would want to come across, as in the written or spoken word, is a spirit of anger. I want way more a spirit of curiosity, asking a lot of questions, but rather than like outright condemning, it just doesn't all. All anger and condemnation does is is divide and lead toward entrenchment. And that's one of the hopes through the ULC is that we build charity, kindness, disagreeing agreeably, actually naming problems and working through them together as the body of Christ, rather than hiding from, from what is actually hurting us as the people of God. So tell us how you developed a love for the written word. A little bit of your story, rachel.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, I've loved to write ever since I was young, I mean as soon as I was learning how to use words. I think the very first poem I wrote was in fourth grade and my mom and dad kept it and they used it at my grandma's funeral, because a lot of my stuff early stuff I grew up, I went to Lutheran grade school and so a lot of my stuff was very Jesus oriented when I was writing when I was younger. But yeah, I always wanted to be a writer, always. I mean, I can't remember a time when I didn't. So I've been doing it for a long time. What I write now is children's nonfiction. I love writing fiction and my goal was always to write adult fiction and I've been writing children's nonfiction for 20 plus years, so I got kind of stuck in here. But I still do play around myself. But I said, well, there might come a day when I'll have more time to do that, but I always loved writing.
Speaker 2:I had in high school had my principal who was also one of my. He was my history teacher. He really encouraged me. That's kind of really what put the flame to it.
Speaker 2:I took this book report that I was supposed to do on these prisoners of war and I just decided that I didn't feel competent enough to write the story myself. So I to write their story. So I did my paper. I went completely off what I was supposed to do and I wrote it as though those prisoners of war were telling their own stories. And so I knew I was not doing it right, but I just did it that way. And I was in study hall and he came in with my paper and slapped it down on the table in front of me and I'm like, oh great, here it comes. And he said you made my date. And he says this is you know. And he went on and on and I was kind of embarrassed because I'm in, all my peers are sitting there and I'm getting this praise, and I was, you know. But that that really. He said you need to do something with writing, this is what you need to do, and so it was his encouragement that really fueled it. So our teachers are so important.
Speaker 1:Isn't that right? Wow, that's a. You know we talked Rachel about the ICNU conversation. He had this encouraging. Isn't that crazy At certain pivotal points in your life that people enter in and they affirm how God has gifted you? He may not have used that language for a while. I'm sure he did. You were in a Lutheran school, right, and everything else just kind of falls into place. So people probably wondering what kind of children's nonfiction? What are some of your favorite projects that you've done? I know you've written on Tom Brady. You know a biography on Tom Brady, a number of those things I did some football yeah.
Speaker 1:Tell just a few of your favorite projects you've worked on, Rachel.
Speaker 2:Yeah, over. Yeah, I used to do a lot of high school level biographies. Yeah, I did some football players and that was fun, and I did Eddie Rickenbacker. Um was one of my, one of my favorite shoe. He's a flying ace. Um, uh, currently I do a lot of these uh fun books. They're, they're, um, it's called curious about what are. The different series are on different topics, and I love the structure because you uh pick questions that a kid might ask about a certain thing. For instance, I did one on on Minecraft and and it's you know, one of the questions is who is Steve? So you know, I mean, and so if you, if you play these games wherever, you kind of know who's who's who, but but it's so you each, each section is a question that a kid might ask and then you answer it in a very fun and engaging way. I really love those curious about books and so I've done several series on those. Those are really fun and, um, I love animals.
Speaker 2:I do a lot of animals, books too, and who doesn't love animals? They did a whole whole bunch of at-risk animals and so that was kind of fun learning about different ecosystems and how how animals, uh, are important to balancing those ecosystems. It was good learning, not something that I'm going to use in everyday life. And, you know, trivial pursuit maybe, I don't know.
Speaker 1:No, that's so cool. Well, that is a calling. You're fanning into flame curiosity in the next generation. I mean, it doesn't get much better than that. So let's talk about the role of storytelling. How does a well-told story, spoken or written, kind of shape and change the human heart and mind?
Speaker 2:Rachel, yeah Well, stories have a capability to pull you in. You get pulled into a different world, maybe even into a different life, and you live out the story as though you're part of it. And so when a character is experiencing emotions and situations and they're dealing with whatever is happening in the story, you're doing that with them. So it's so powerful because you can change the way you think about something just because the character is changing the way they see something. And at the end of the story if it's a good story the character has grown and changed and you kind of hope that people do that in their own story, the human story.
Speaker 2:I always think I want to be a different person a year from now than I am today, because my story is continuing to play out and I got to be paying attention and learning to this and building my character along the way. Just like a book, just like a book. So I want to get to the end of my story and look back and say, yeah, I was a worthwhile character because I changed and grew and, in your faith, in your relationships, man, the way I deal with things with my family now, compared to five years ago, totally different and I'm glad for that. It's a blessing to you, know, just, but you have to really be paying attention, and there's a lot of distractions in our world that pull us off in different ways.
Speaker 1:But yeah, a good story can, Isn't that right? So it changes, it changes us. So the hero's journey have you heard that kind of? There's an overarching hero's journey and you can see it kind of in Scripture in many respects and the greatest hero in all of Scripture is obviously Jesus, our Savior. But how would you if someone has never heard of, or maybe they've heard of but they don't understand the ins and outs of kind of the hero's journey, rachel, how would you define that?
Speaker 2:Oh boy, it's been a long time since I've, I've, I've gone over that and exactly what you're talking about, because there's a quest and there's the off the top of my head I don't remember all the, all the sequences to that but there's struggle, there's always struggle, there's a quest and yeah, right and so, but that's, you know, it's, that's typical of stories. There's, there's your rising action and your and your, your climax and your falling action. Um, I don't know, I, I don't, um, yeah, well, oh yeah, exactly what did say that again, I mean, rephrase that so just look at, let's look at Jesus' life real quick.
Speaker 1:He entered in. There's a setting of the scene, right? Who are the other characters in the scene? And then Jesus starts to experience beauty, wonder, awe, transformation, but also a lot of suffering and trial, and the height of his suffering. And the biggest question then, as we watch any kind of hero's story, is are they going to make it? Are they going to come out the other side? And we know that the other side is through sacrifice, through suffering, through loss. This is the way of the cross. And then there's transformation. There's something different on the other side and people watch that story.
Speaker 1:And this is the wild thing about the human brain, right, rachel, is we have these mirror neurons. We actually, like you were saying earlier, we're experiencing it with Jesus, we're walking now with Jesus, and so we're definitely not the hero of the story. This is where the hero story doesn't work for a Christian per se, because we're here following the hero. He's done it all. But there is a path, there is a way, and it looks like less of me. It's growing in self-awareness, but not getting stuck in self-consciousness, which is where insecurity lies. And we see that's the downward journey into more and more of me, more and more insecurity. But the hero. After they have walked through the struggle, they have this recognition that, wow, I was shaped through suffering, through sacrifice, through service, through even death to self and giving my life away. This is the call to follow Jesus, this is every Christian's discipleship journey.
Speaker 1:You could look at some of the Pilgrim's Progress a book like that that shows what they learned. You could look at the book of Job, obviously. You could look at the story of Moses, but it's through suffering and loss rather than around it. And I think today we're trying to do everything we possibly can to not walk that inevitable road of suffering and loss. But here's the beautiful thing I road of suffering and loss, but here's the beautiful thing. I know that suffering produces something. This is Romans 5. It produces perseverance, character, hope. Think of one of the greatest heroes in the New Testament right is the Apostle Paul. He went on that Jesus heroes journey. So anything to just add to that, as I kind of riff on what that journey kind of looks like.
Speaker 2:You know, when you talk about the Jesus that we're it's not. Jesus is the hero of the story, but he makes us heroes too. Through that and whenever you're walking through that I don't know if you you know, I'm sure you have you go through a time of struggle, because we do. Jesus says it's going to happen and it does, but he's beat it and you know how the story isn't going to end here. You're in that struggle and you have to say I just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other because this isn't over yet. I know it's not over because Jesus said it's not over yet. He won. And so it gives you the heart to know that your story ends with a victory and his hero lives in us and we're going to be heroes, too, because of that.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, we're in Christ in the ultimate end. This is so good. It's hope. This is what the suffering and sacrifice it produces hope in us. And what is our hope? It's the restoration of all things in the last day, when Jesus comes back to make all things new right.
Speaker 1:And so, even if, you know, a lot of times we walk through struggle, oh, and we go. What if? What if Two words will shift it. Even if, oh, I lose a loved one, even if I lose my job, even if I'm publicly scorned for something, you know, I'm still loved by the God of the universe, who redeemed me, claimed me in the waters of baptism, has beautiful things through the suffering and he's coming back to dry every tear and to raise the dead. So I don't have to, even if X happens, I don't have to be afraid. The perfect love of Jesus, because I'm enveloped in his love. It casts out, casts out fear. So that's the greatest story of all time, isn't it? Just talk about? Just talk about the narrative of the Bible in your experience and what it produces in you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I, you know, like anyone else that you know, my life has had a lot of ups and downs. Anyone else that you know, my life has had a lot of ups and downs, and you know I was just. I was just going over some of that the other day. It was retrospective. And one thing that you know I look at my journey with, I had kind of a falling away, not from God but from church as an institution. I had some things happen in my youth where I felt let down or whatever the case may be, but I never got.
Speaker 2:And then thinking about that is he's always been faithful, through every up and down, every mistake, every victory, every loss, victory, every loss, every. He's always been faithful. I never felt. I mean sometimes you say, oh, you know, is he hearing me, is he listening to me? But in my heart, never, ever felt abandoned, always had that, you know, hope to carry you through every circumstance in your life, always, and just being knowledge of his, the instruction that he's given through all of these um instances in my life, just the instruction and trying to build, build on to the faith and build on to the character um that he wants me to be and um, so yeah, I mean, I just I don't know, I don't know what I would do without, without him and my faith. Um, just so. Woven in Amen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he is.
Speaker 1:He is so faithful uh and he loves us relentlessly and he's not. He's not going to let us go, I'm not going to let us go. So, um, let's get back. Get back to the written word a bit. There may be some pastors listening who say I don't know, like most pastors, I think like writing maybe, but sometimes you feel like you're stuck or you're not where you want to be.
Speaker 1:Being a pastor or a leader in the church. It's word work, right, it's both spoken and written work. But some pastors, maybe younger pastors too, there may be a trend toward and I'm not being judgmental here, I have seen a decline in writing skills, in grammar, sentence construction and things in the next generation. And I kind of tell my kids like you can really really distinguish yourself well as you move into the professional marketplace by learning to write well, learning to, yeah, shape sentences in a compelling and clear fashion, right. So what would you say to, maybe, the younger leader who says, man, I've tried, but I'm just not a good writer? What words of encouragement would you give to them, rachel?
Speaker 2:Oh well, I would say, first of all, you're not done yet. You can always improve a skill. I would say the very first thing to do is read more, read, read, read, read, read, read, read, um, and good books, not, you know, don't? You know there are, there are good books, and then there are books that are not going to lead you in the right direction. You know I, you know I, I'm big on classic literature, but, um, it's a good way to learn writing skills, but, um, yeah, I mean, I think social social media just does not help at all, for, for a younger generation, as far as any grammar in any way, and all the slang usage, you know the way they spell things, the way things are spelled or whatever, like, oh my goodness, this is just destroying everything.
Speaker 2:Stop, I mean, I'm, I'm a grammar person. It's like stop, stop, we got to use the comma there. Don't use the comma there. I can't, I can hardly look at memes sometimes because they just aren't punctuated properly. You know, um, but don't, you, don't give.
Speaker 2:I mean, just, everybody has a different style and I think, um, fine, you know, if you find a style that you really like you, that's probably to read, that's probably your style that you write, your you associate with it, um, that author, keep doing it. But it's okay to have a different style. Some people are very simplistic and some people, you know, get real technical. That's okay. And probably most importantly is you just if you write from your heart and you take yourself out of it. It's not about me, it's about especially if, if you're writing about, about, uh, church and and jesus, and it's all about bring glory to him. It's all about bring glory to him and if you keep that focus in your head, there you will reach. The holy spirit will use you to reach someone and and don't worry if it's not perfect, you know the message will get there because the Holy Spirit is working through it. It's not take yourself out of it, let the Holy Spirit lead it.
Speaker 2:I know that over the years you go to you visit different churches and every pastor has a different style and I always get kind of bothered by people who are like they go sample around churches because they want to find the right preacher. You know it's like, oh, I really want someone who's charismatic or this or that, and and I'm always like, okay, go where the doctrine, what the doctrine is, what you believe and let God take care of the rest, Because I've I've had pastors who were really gifted and pastors that were just okay, you know, and no, you know what. I never left a church service without it touching my heart in some way. It doesn't matter if, if you're the greatest or whatever, god's going to use you to reach someone and and so it's. Don't be afraid, just just just keep trying.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and keep reading. That's what I'm taking from what you're offering. I mean, I'm a voracious reader. I can't really. My number one in Strength Finders I don't know if you've ever taken that assessment is learning. That's one of the reasons I love podcasts so much, because I get to interact with amazing people like you and learn. And I love the written word. Man I got about. I'm a little different.
Speaker 1:I got probably five books going at any one time in all different directions, right From a deeply theological historical book to a psychological, maybe the spiritual care lane. I'm thinking of the books that are on my on my shelf right next to my stationary bike to a current event kind of literature, like all different types of literature, and that that. Or leadership. I didn't even mention leader. I got leadership books that I'm kind of digging into how to, how to lead a healthy team, casting vision, blah, blah, blah, all those types of things, and I and I just love it from deep Lutheran confessional teaching and I want to be able. Here's one of my goals. I'd love to get your take on this, but I want to be able to have intelligent conversations with a variety of people. It doesn't mean I'm an expert by any stretch. I just realized if I know a little about a lot or I know a lot about a little, it still just moves me. Because in the leadership space you could say I've read so much. I don't even like using the word expert because that says that you've kind of like arrived there. You never arrived because your context is always changing and how the word is working on you in that season of life, it's all, it's all changing. So you're never really an expert, but I know a fair amount about leadership. But it just moves me, moves me out and in in curiosity and I I pray for the wider church, the Lutheran Church, missouri Synod, that more leaders would just have great curiosity and hold very, very, very few things with a closed fist.
Speaker 1:This is one of my favorite metaphors there's so many ideas and there's freedom. This is Luther's freedom of a Christian. There's great freedom now to explore a variety of different topics, because I know who I am and I'm going to learn. The Word's going to shape me and it's just the best Pastors that, because I know a handful, they're like I just don't like to read. We better be reading, like the Bible. The Bible is a very good book to internalize right. So I don't know how a pastor could get in this profession that I don't read much. So a big shout out pastors read, read, read, read. From the Lutheran confessions to current events we have to be in and the word actually then shapes us and we can have intelligent conversations, hopefully with curiosity rather than condemnation, and humility and great humility. So anything more to add to that kind of rant there, rachel, on the necessity of reading.
Speaker 2:And, as we talked about earlier how stories, you know that living through the character, through the character, how it can change you and make you grow. It can help you better understand other people. I mean just dealing with different personalities or different situations, just in relationships with each other, have a better understanding about how someone else might be thinking or how someone else their behaviors might, what those behaviors might mean. It just helps you be more empathetic, more compassionate, just a more Jesus-oriented heart, and just opens your mind.
Speaker 1:All right, we're going to go to the opposite end of the spectrum. Let's speak to the readers and potential authors out there. You're going to help me get a book here in the wider for the wider church, for the marketplace, et cetera, but they just don't maybe have the discipline necessary to to get it going. It feels daunting when you think of, like you're writing a book, how many, how many thousands of words probably like a 60 to 80, like that's a lot, of a lot of words, Right? And and sometimes, sometimes actually, you read books and you're like I think they should have stopped, like a number of pages ago, but they were maybe hitting a quota or something like that, and you don't want to be that guy or that gal, right? So any words of wisdom on developing the discipline to get a book to the finish line.
Speaker 2:First, I would start with prayer and talk to Jesus about it and ask for his help to see it through, and I would probably set aside to get it real structured. Set aside from every day or every other day, from this time to this time. This is what I'm doing and I'm not going to let anything else interrupt that. This is what I'm going to do. And you know what, every day I would say this about. When I write, I was like, okay, every day might not be my best day, but I try my best every day. So you know, I might not, I might really struggle with words one day and then the next day everything just comes along and that's okay, go back and fix the other stuff, it's fine. But set aside that time and be disciplined about doing it and don't let anything else interrupt that time. We do the same thing with exercising. Right, you say I'm going to exercise from this time to this time and nothing else.
Speaker 2:If someone says, hey, I want to do this at this time or whatever, no, I got something scheduled to do and you just have to say this is the time we're doing it, um, keep a notebook and pencil on your bed stand, because oftentimes the best thoughts and ideas come to you when you're lying in bed, so that you can write it down, because you'll wake up, maybe even wake up in the middle of the night. You're like, oh yeah, this would be great, but then I'll remember that in the morning you fall back asleep, you don't remember it. You get up right, then write it down. You'll forget it. Just write it down and keep something right by your bed, because that happens so often. You have a great idea in the middle of the night and it's gone in the morning. So and I would just you know, I wouldn't you know you maybe want to just keep pushing ahead instead of going back and reworking things. Just, you know, get, get the whole, the basics out there first, and then you can go back and do your editing after that.
Speaker 1:That's so good I love. I love your take on the note notepad by the bedside or by the shower, your parasympathetic system right, your parasympathetic system. When right your parasympathetic system. When you're at rest, it unlocks the subconscious toward creativity. There's a lot of research on this. And when you're in the more work mode I have to do it right now Right that, some of the ideas that you just feel feel stuck here. Here's a. I'll give a real life example.
Speaker 1:Um, in a meeting with people I trust, cause I love collaborative writing, I love bouncing ideas off people, and I just think we're we're better together and even though, if you're going to be the author of a book, like how many people help shape that right and hone it? But we were doing some creative planning yesterday for Christmas Now we're in August, shout out to our team Like they're working hard on some of our Christmas ideas and we were just kicking stuff around and it was like there was a piece in the room and then this, like I don't know where it came from, but this idea from a variety of different things, because we just kind of let the room sit. And I think this is what happens when you're at rest, going to go into bed. You know, a similar thing, this idea for a concept for a video that's going to be in line with a theme that should really really inspire folks around, our theme of the real Christmas kind of came and it was. It was funny how it just it just popped and the whole group kind of said yeah, yeah, that that we're moving in a good direction. It's going to get refined. But, yeah, to experience that from time to time I think it's one of my favorite professors from the seminary Joel Bierman it's when you're in the zone or fully human.
Speaker 1:We're never fully human because of our sin nature, but in Christ we're fully complete in Him. When you're at that place of peace and you're in the zone there like there have been times too in in writing where I'm like I don't even know where this is coming from God hello, you know, like God is just like. You're connected. You're just so like present I guess that's another way to define it. You're not worried about what has happened or what's going to happen. You're just right there in that moment. And for writers, getting in the zone is kind of a. It's a very holy spiritual thing. Anything more to say about that, rachel, I'm sure you've been there many times.
Speaker 2:It is. There's times where you just wow, where did that even come from? Well, yeah, of course it came from God, and I love your story example. Or you guys quieted down and the Holy Spirit just filled the room Boom, and that's such a powerful experience too, and I think you're right, we need to quiet down because we've got so many distractions. I remember being in prayer one time and it was like God spoke to me and you can't hear me through all the noise and I thought, wow, I need God's trying to talk to me and I am. I'm not listening. I have to shut things, turn things off. I need to shut myself up and listen when God's trying to talk. So I think I think when it yeah, you're right, we need to have that time, too, where we shut everything off, and whether that's your time in prayer or maybe it's your writing time just to shut off all the distractions and let the Holy Spirit in, because we do lock it out. We get so busy and preoccupied with everything else in life that we miss out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we do. My favorite book right now of the five I have going is by a psychologist Christian psychologist by the name of Andi Kolber, and she is highlighting. It's called Try Softer, try Softer. I think the tagline is the pathway toward connectivity and joy, toward connectivity and joy. And it's playing off of how trying harder just doesn't work. It may work in the short term, but it moves us eventually, maybe externally or internally, like some external event happens, that moves us toward anxiety or cutting off into what they call hyperarousal or hypo arousal, which is depression. Hyper arousal is fight, flight and those kind of tendencies.
Speaker 1:But the most helpful part of it I've said this in another podcast too but is the window of tolerance, and the window and I like using people may think tolerance is liberal or something like that it's just a softness for yourself and for the people who are around you. And the goal, as we mature more and more into the image of Jesus, is that window of tolerance would expand. It gets bigger and bigger and bigger. Jesus is right there in the middle of that window. He's smiling over us and therefore, as the stuff comes, as the chaos comes, the suffering, loss comes, we get to live in that window of care, thinking about what we're thinking about, lovingly challenging our thoughts that would move us toward a hyper or hypo arousal and living with the peace of Jesus and the joy of Jesus there, in that window of tolerance.
Speaker 1:When I'm in that space, that's when the best writing, that's when the best connection to God and others comes. There's a peace there and I can actually think there, you know, I can go to. My subconscious is more engaged. I just feel more alive when I'm there. Unfortunately, in our culture, far too many people are living at one of those two extremes either fighting or fleeing, or freezing in the midst of stuff, because we've not dealt with a lot of the trauma, you could say the chaos, that is within us and around us. Well, homestretch here, jesus' people should be like the most peace-filled, the most joy-filled and the most creative in our gifting, in our unique individual gifting. The most creative, inspiring people, purpose-filled people on the planet right, that should be us, because we know who we are and we know the end of the story. So any response though, to that kind of window of tolerance, kind of metaphor there, rachel.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, boy, I was just. I'm stuck on you. We should be the the, the vision of just peace and joy, and how often that that we fail in that regard. Yeah, just boy, you know, I'm just thinking. I just got stuck on that because it's so true.
Speaker 2:But it does take persistence and consistent work to that sometimes, because the devil is always trying to distract us and pull us away from that joy and that peace, and I think sometimes we get lazy and we don't want to keep fighting it. You know it's work. Sometimes it's work to remind yourself over and over again look, you know, look at what I have, look at what Jesus has given me. I need to live peacefully, I need to show joy. I have to do this.
Speaker 2:And the devil says, yeah, but you've got this going on, you've got that going on, you're struggling through this and that. You know how can you be happy for that? He's caught. So you have to. It's a constant battle and you have to be persistent about it. And, um, I think sometimes people just stop fighting and and it's easier to give in than to, than to keep fighting it, but honestly, it it's easier, it should be easier to, to accept the joy, because look at all the anxiety and trouble it gives you to to give up on that and go in the other direction. But um, yeah, we, we have all of the reason in the world to be to be, be joyful and be sharing that with other people.
Speaker 1:Isn't that right?
Speaker 2:Everybody should feel that way. Everybody needs that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, amen. Listen to Paul's words in Colossians. I've been reading Colossians recently, in chapter 1, verse 11. May you be strengthened, he's writing to the church here in Colossae, right. May you be strengthened with all power, according to his glorious might, for all endurance and patience. These are some of my favorite words, with joy, giving thanks to the Father.
Speaker 1:Who has qualified you this is identity and this is your future. Who has qualified you? This is identity and this is your future? Who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of the saints and light? He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. I mean, it doesn't get any better than that. Right, paul's reminding them of who they are, whose they are, the mission that they're on, the future is taken care of, and the purpose and strength, the patient endurance, the joyful endurance that we walk and run with as followers of Jesus. Yeah, it's kind of isn't that the best pep talk Like?
Speaker 1:Sometimes we think, hey, you know, we got to be kind of stoic and kind of reserved. Like the Apostle. Paul's writing is inspired, that's like the understatement of all understatements, right, inspired by the Holy Spirit which pointed us and him to Jesus, the crucified and risen one. So I just pray for more writing like that, more speaking like that, rather than living in anxiety, fear, worry, doubt, power struggle, all of that, just keeping our eyes firmly fixed upon Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith. So last question what do you love most about Jesus, rachel, and how has your love for Jesus just grown over the years?
Speaker 2:Oh well, I kind of touched on it earlier the faithfulness, the presence that I, that it just through every up and down in life, that presence, and I'm so thankful, honestly, for all of the struggles that I have gone through and those that I'm facing now, because it always, every single one of them, brings me closer to him. And when things are going great, I don't feel that closeness. And I wish I could get better at feeling that closeness when I'm on the one on the mountaintop, because in the valley I feel that closeness more. It's almost like just give me, give me something, give me a problem, please, so I can feel closer to you, um, but that's what you know, it's just having that, that, that closeness, that hope, um, that it's, it's you're always, you're going to overcome, no matter what, always going to overcome.
Speaker 2:And I look back sometimes as you look at those ups and downs or whatever, and you and you see that God is carrying you through it and it did, it did, and you kind of put the pieces together. Well, this had to happen for this and this all worked out and he's got it all put together. So don't worry about it, you know, pray on it and trust that he's got a plan and he's working it out and it's all going to work out perfectly and just got to follow that and just having that knowledge and that best friend. I think I used that last night when I was praying. I was like you're just my best friend ever and that's how it is, having that best friend who is never going to leave you, no matter what. He's just always by your side.
Speaker 1:And always learning, like you do with friends.
Speaker 2:You're always learning, you're always growing. Your friendship's always growing. When, when you're, when you're connected, it's always growing stronger. You're always learning more. He's teaching me more about himself and about myself and and what he wants me to be, and just that, how that friendship just continues to grow. Um, it's just the most precious thing to grow.
Speaker 1:It's just the most precious thing. Well, thank you for being my friend and partner in the written word. You're a gift to me in the body of Christ, here at Christ Greenfield and beyond through your work with the ULC. If people wanted to connect with you and if they got kids that want to like, where could they even find rachel grack books? You know where are they on amazon? Where are you sold at rachel? Yeah, I love it what's that yeah?
Speaker 1:no, they're on. How could they, how could they connect with you? We may have go on amazon, um, and google it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, great, I mean, that pops up. I don, I don't really like to sell myself like that, but yeah, if you're interested in seeing what's out there, yeah, google it. You can Google me too. Yeah, some stuff comes up and just go and Google, but yeah, it's a very, very small world.
Speaker 1:Right, and what is your email, Rachel?
Speaker 2:It is rgrock G-R-A-C-K at Hotmail.
Speaker 1:All right, wonderful, wonderful to hang out with you today. This is the American Reformation Podcast. Sharing is caring, like, subscribe, comment wherever it is that you take in these podcasts, and we'll continue to have Jesus-filled, just like this one, joy-filled, creativity-filled times together as Rachel's cat jumps up. So so good. Rachel, you're a gift, gift to me into the body of Christ. We'll be back next week with another fresh episode of American Reformation. Thanks, rachel.
Speaker 2:Thank you.